United States of Race
United States of Race
Episode 8: Rock 'n Roll Is As American As It Gets
Nick - lead of the band Buenos Diaz - has been playing rock 'n roll all his life, but that hasn’t stopped people from typecasting him and his music to fit their own assumptions.
Check out the latest from Buenos Diaz at www.buenosdiazmusic.com
I'm American, as much as I my parents were born or grandparents or great grandparents were born in Mexico. I mean, I was born in America, as an inner city kid in Houston, Texas. I'm American, whatever you want to call that. But America is a melting pot. It's a lot of things. It's black kids, it's white kids, it's Mexican kids, it's Japanese kids. It's American.
DB Crema:This is United States of Race, personal stories of how our earliest memories determine a lifetime of relationships. Each episode features one guest sharing their experiences with race. Keeping these episodes anonymous lets our guests share the real uninhibited stories of their life. And it gives us the chance to listen without prejudice. I'm your host, DB Crema. Today, we're joined by Nick who's been playing rock 'n roll all his life. But that hasn't stopped people from typecasting him and his music based on their own assumptions. So tell me about your experience with race.
Nick:I don't think I've ever experienced racism, or cultural profiling via my skin color. I'm light skinned, my family's pretty light skinned for being Mexican and definitely for being Tex Mex. Like most Tex Mex are darker in skin complexion. So we've always gotten the get out of jail free pass, that people really don't judge us or aren't as quick to judge just because they see us. Maybe if they hear our last name, then they might have thoughts ready, as whatever goes through the head of someone that racially profiles people. And I think I've run into that, even with my work as an artist and having a Latino name. I mean, I have had people come up to me and be like, "Oh, we thought it was gonna be Latin music". Just because the name of the group is Buenos Diaz, which is my last name. This one instance really comes to mind, I was playing this really nice club, and it's like a listening dinner club. So you sit and you drink and eat while the show's going on. And after I played there, specifically, this lady came up to me and she had written a note. I don't really remember exactly what it said anymore, but she'd written a note. And was just like, you're holding yourself back by having a Latino name as your band name because your music isn't obviously, Latin anything, you know? And I was like, why would you think that? To me, that's just like, you're just judging a book by its cover. Without having any knowledge, without researching anything, because if you did one ounce of research and just listened to a song online, it's all rock and roll. There's not one lyric in Spanish or anything. But in her eyes, I'm not succeeding, maybe where she thinks I could get. But the reality is like I don't...I'm doing fine without those gigs or the extra things that might come because I just anglicized my name, for your comfort level.
DB Crema:You're holding your music career back by using your own name.
Nick:Right? Right. It's my own name, right? It's a play on the name, but it's my name.\
DB Crema:Which is then telling you that by using your own name, which happens to be Latino, there is only one genre of music that you should be playing and and can be categorized within. Mmm hmm.
Nick:Okay, so then here's the flip side, I don't have any place in the world of Latin music. Like, none of my lyrics are in Spanish. There's no Latin rhythms in my music. So the funny thing is that it's like these people that think my name embodies this certain style of music, it's like but then you put my band in the categories of Latin music where, which this is what this audience member was thinking. It's like, I'm not gonna get any Latin Grammy Awards. I'm not gonna have like Latin producers coming to want to produce my music. I've hung out with people in that world and they love what I do. And I think they think it's super cool because there aren't a lot of Latin rock and rollers either in America. I mean, really, there are three that I can often top of my head think of. Me, Santana, and Lo Lobos. Aside from that, it's li e, there really isn't. And ac ually, those bands though, in orporate Latin rhythms in th ir music still, and I don't. So it's like, I mean, I play ro k and roll, man, like, who ca es what the name is? You know.
DB Crema:Your band name is rather witty.
Nick:It's really witty, isn't it? I love that name. One of my best friends in New York when I lived in Brooklyn, he coined that at some point. The light bulb went off and I said, that is brilliant. I'm taking that and he said, you should.
DB Crema:Yeah, you know. Absolutely. But also, so if you're Polish and you choose to incorporate some aspect of your Polishname into your American band, should you only be playing the polka? Like, what does that mean? What is that even?
Nick:What is that even, your right. I mean, it exists because that's how people sell things, which really goes to the essence of America, which is just capitalism and you know, trying to move product. And so that's probably where the confusion comes in. It's like, I don't know what to do with this, like, you don't really need to know what to do with it, it's just good. Just let it be good. You know? Stop thinking about that it has to fit in this box that you're gonna sell, you know. We're such a culture of boxes, and like, fitting it into this thing, so that I understand it. And it's like, that's what I say, when people ask me, you know, what is the style of music that we play? And I said, Well, you know what, man, I've lived all over the country for over 15-18 years. And when I came home to Texas, and put this project together, it's an embodiment of all of this life experience. And all this culture, and this gumbo of, you know, these awesome American cities where I went to, like, not only be a musician in those towns, but really, really learn the local ways and local culture of those great cities. Because to me, that's the essence of great, you know, regionally, indigenous music is like, there's a reason New Orleans music is amazing. And it only comes from New Orleans. Same thing in New York City with the style of pop and you know, more commercialized music, it's the reason that it comes from there, you know. So, yeah, why do you want to pigeonhole it to be this one thing when it's this kind of beautiful cornucopia of just American music? And, you know, being polite and being an optimist is that, maybe that, I mean, yes, on the surface, that woman was, that was a racist comment. In hindsight, it's no different than, you know, anyone that's like, approached me and said, you know, you're holding yourself back. They just want the best for me, I get that. That's, I think, where they're coming from more than being racist, even though that is racist, you know.
DB Crema:Which is funny, because I would see it the exact opposite in terms of not holding yourself back. Being an American rocker is awesome. But also there's no shortage of musicians and artists out there. So if you have something that sets you apart, not only in your sound, but also in your image, and that includes, of course, your band name, that can only help you.
Nick:It's not holding anything back. Yeah. It's doing a pretty good job of pushing it forward. But, people are the way they are. Yeah. People don't want to hear,... they wanna hear what they want to hear.
DB Crema:But they also want to be able to say what they want to say.
Nick:And they want to say what they want to say. I mean, there's a part of me that likes to forward think a little more. And I think we're humans, I don't care about cultural identity as much as maybe the next person.
DB Crema:Hmm, interesting.
Nick:And maybe that's because of how I was raised, you know, like I mean, I was raised in a full Mexican home. But I went to school with nothing, but you know, pretty much Anglo kids. So my upbringing as a kid, most of the time, because, you know, you spend your time in school and around your friends was around, you know, white people. So maybe that has to do with kind of blurring that line more for me. I remember being in seventh grade at this, you know, really ritzy, you know, private school that I was fortunate enough to go to, but then being fortunate enough to go to the school, I mean, I was the only Mexican kid in the high school. And I only went to school there from seventh grade to 12th grade. So I had experience in public school and some other schools at a younger age, and I mean, the public schools were a total mix of kids, obviously, you know. Poor kids, rich kids, black kids, white kids, Mexicans, whatever, you know. And this school itself is like, for the most part, it was white. And also like, it's in this really, really wealthy neighborhood in Houston called River Oaks. I didn't live in that neighborhood, we lived on the other side of town in the predominantly like, lower middle class Mexican neighborhood, where my mom grew up. And so every day, I was like, I would go to this rich neighborhood, and you know, this beautiful environment to learn, which again, amazing. But then I would shuffle back to the other side of town. And it's like, we lived in a very modest two and a half bedroom house with a mom and three kids. And a mom that
worked until 11:30 at night sometimes. So my reality was this serious, like split of like going to this really comfortable, great environment to be safe and learn and, like, be pushed, you know, intellectually and personally, but then always, every day reminded of where that's not your reality, though. You know, maybe you can get there if you play by their rules, and you learn everything they want you to learn and dress the way they want you to dress and cut your hair the way they want you to cut your hair, but then it's like I'm in, you know, back in the hood. And it's like, it was a really interesting split. I don't think I paid attention to that as much as when I was in public school. But once I got to that school, which was like 12-13 was, I think, when I really became more aware of the racial division via spending time in those two way different worlds.
DB Crema:Do you remember feeling resentful?
Nick:I never felt resentfull. Ummm I don't think there was time to feel resentful. I mean, my schedule was so full. I mean, there were so many things to do. Iron your clothes, make your lunch, do your homework, play sports, which I did, and then do it all every day. And I mean, I loved my friends, my friends were cool. And you know, there was the weirdness of like, none of them were ever comfortable, or their parents weren't comfortable of them coming to where I lived. But I was always invited to like a number of kids houses, and I spent a lot of weekends at their houses, and some even footed the bill and, like, brought me to Colorado on a summer vacation, or, like, out in the hill country in Texas, and I'd vacation with their family at the river house. And, um, yeah, I mean, really, if I was resentful, I wouldn't have made it through it. I don't thin. And then also, I remember thinking like, man I don't want to live like this when I'm a grown up, because I knew what else was out there already. And so it was more like, I gotta do what I got to do to at least get close to that. I mean, I don't need a mansion in the richest neighborhood in Texas. But I could sure use a comfortable home and a clean environment and a safe environment to just exist in. It was, it's literally just about, like, I mean, I've experienced living in the hood. It's not cool. It's unsafe, it's dark. It's like hungry, it's cold, it's hot. It's like all these things. It's like, you live in a prettier, safer place. It's like, it just kind of evens all that out. And you aren't thinking about those things anymore, which allows you to do other things. So, and I was a fine student. It's like, I mean, I had already discovered music. So it's like, I was distracted, for sure. And especially in a college preparatory school like that. It's like where the focus is academics. So I'd already found something else that I really, already knew what I wanted to do. I didn't want to go to corporate America, I didn't want to go get a law degree. I didn't want to go to Harvard. Funny enough. That's what even played into my college selection of university, was like, I only looked at music cities. I looked at Memphis, I looked at Chicago and I looked at it, Austin and New Orleans. And I ended up with a tiny scholarship that I ended up losing because I was playing music and hanging out all night already, anyways.
DB Crema:As a creative, as an artist, as a musician. Do you feel like race ever influences or shows up in your music? You're playing American music, which clearly draws on a history of, primarily on a history of black music, black American music, but...
Nick:I grew up playing blues and blues clubs in Houston. I mean, Houston has a really rich blues scene and rich history of blues musicians that became - some super well known and some not. So no, I mean, I grew up playing black music. And there's still that element and undertone to what I do. And Funny enough, like I've written a song and it's about, I mean, police brutality song, you know. I've written songs about, you know, black profiling. I actually have a couple songs written about Mexican women that, you know, in NAFTA, it opened up the, you know, for there to be factories on the borders. And then these Mexican women were being bused in from the mountains and the hills, you know, further away in Mexico, and they would go work for 14 hours a day, and then bused back home. And some of them would get kidnapped and raped and dumped to the desert and never found, and never heard from again, like endless names, countless names, and nobody even talks about this. I've written songs about that, you know. So like, I mean, I touch on racial motives. I think more it has to do with.... To me, it's more about human targeting and people, innocent people that are just targeted and murdered or killed and then not even thought twice about, which is all still partially racial, you know? I mean, I'm not writing about white people getting dumped in the desert.
DB Crema:Are white people discriminated against ? Do white people experience race -ased discrimination.
Nick:I think white people probably...I would step out on a limb here and say, I would imagine white people face more classism than racism. I mean, I don't know, I'm not white.
DB Crema:I think as a white person hearing, the focus, the current focus on Black Lives Matter. Really, the biggest concern in your mind is that all lives matter. What about your needs? It overlooks their challenges, it juxtaposes these two things as mutually exclusive- it's one or the other.
Nick:Yeah, I really, you know, I mean, I've thought about the Black Lives Matter slogan. And I mean, yes, Black Lives Matter. It's the truth. There's not taking anything away from that, that's not making that any less of a reality. But just like any label, Black Lives
DB Crema:But these are issues about systemic injustice. Matter, the way it's written, just like a lady thinks Buenos Diaz is Latin music. It means you're excluding everyone else, and it's just black people. And I can imagine that's why some white people have been offended. But it's not about white people. It's really that's about like, acknowledging that black people have had it harder than anyone else. We're not saying you haven't had it hard, but right now, this is really important because like black people are just getting killed in the street. White people typically aren't prejudiced against. And I mean, nothing is black and white. That's not a black and white statement to say that there hasn't been a white person that has been racially profiled. Maybe in a black neighborhood, or... that's a tough, I think that's a tough place to be. I've felt that. Black Lives Matter, and I'm like, but what about all the brown Mexicans, man? Like, we don't get jobs, and we get shit on and like we work 50 hours a day, picking oranges and cleaning dishes in bus tations. And I'm not saying hat, like, we need to be part f this movement. But it's just ike, will there ever be a brown ives matter movement? Will here ever be a recognition of he entire like brown history hat has been wiped off the face f the planet, because all these panish Conquistadores and eople from Europe came to South merica and just decided to ike, take what they wanted,
Nick:Absolutely.
DB Crema:How do we grapple with that, even from an artistic ust like everyone did in merica, too. And it's like, here's a lot of America, you now, and there's a lot more han just what happens the nited States that doesn't even et discussed, you know? So, I ean, I support bringing racial wareness to the surface more or black people, I completely level? upport that. There's so many evels of it, you know, and that
Nick:Artistic level and a family level, you know. I mean, oes back so far, you know, lack people can only play r&b nd hip hop, like, taking it ack to music, you know. It's ust like, I bet there's a t n of black musicians out there t at love rock and roll music nd want to go rock out and do his and that, and they probab y don't feel comfortable doing it. a lot of systemic racism and systemic injustices stem from some kind of not getting taught right at home. Something. Something didn't get told to someone and passed down the line, you know? Well, and not all the time, but that's part of it.
DB Crema:I would say, something got passed down. I think we're all...
Nick:Yeah, or something does get passed down that shouldn't have been passed down.
DB Crema:You know, like, I try to imagine what would America look like moving forward, if we no longer taught our children about race?
Nick:At all, you mean?
DB Crema:At all.
Nick:Like, there's no black people, there's no... they're just people. Is that what you mean?
DB Crema:Yeah. I mean...
Nick:I mean, that's utopia. Good, good... Have at it. I would love to see that more than anything, you know. Because it's stupid. What does it matter what skin color you are, you know? Why does it matter to people so much?
DB Crema:I think we're always going to find something to try to hold power over each other. If it weren't race...
Nick:Yeah, it'd be something else. Probably. I mean, I think that's, I think it is more just human nature. You know, I mean, humans have fought over whatever, forever. There's just this inner greed, for lack of a better word or, you know, thinking of the right word of like wanting more and more and more and at the expense of our other fellow humans. And not everyone is like this, obviously, there's some great humans. But where racism lies, again, is like a thing, I think just pushing people down so that some other people can get ahead. You know, and get more of this stuff that we've all created for ourselves. This world, these cars and things, you know - material world, consumer world. But how do you take that out of the equation? I mean, that's human. Greed is human. You know? You would have to address human desire and human greed, I think, to address racism.
DB Crema:Thanks for listening to United States of Race. This podcast was produced by me, your host, DB Crema, and our artwork is designed by Aly Creative. If you love great storytelling, go ahead and subscribe to United States of Race on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And show us some love by rating and writing a review on Apple Podcasts or Podchaser. You see podchaser.com is the world's most comprehensive podcast database. So rating and writing a review there helps us get the message out and helps other listeners discover this amazing show. And you can also share this podcast with your friends, and anyone who believes in the power of building connection through sharing personal stories. You can also follow us on Instagram at all one word unitedstatesofrace. And as always, if you, Yes, you have a compelling story to share and would like to be featured on an upcoming episode, send us a message at unitedstatesofrace@gmail.com. Until next time.